NITAAI Yoga The Pure Love of the Soul

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

I decided to start daily writing of about my insignificant efforts to chant Holy Names of Nityananda, Gauranga and Hare Krsna Maha Mantra in order to purify myself and glorify this sublime and highest process of devotional service â€“ Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna Naam Yoga, in hope that this will give me some inspiration to increase quantity and quality of chanting. I am hoping that any of you, my well-wishers, friends and readers of this diary will find some satisfaction and help me in this spiritual attempt to satisfy my spiritual master, His Holiness Srilla Bhaktiratna Sadhu Swami Gaurangapada, and that this writing will also inspire you to chant Nityananda Gauranga and Hare Krsna.

I am considering myself completely offensive and fallen, and mercy of my Gurudeva is only reason why I am still trying to make some progress. Procrastination and hesitation are my worst enemies and yesterday I realized that it is possible to overcome any problem/doubt only with sincere effort to chant Holy Names. Without sincere chanting I am feeling to be constantly on dry mental platform where dark clouds of speculations and torments of false identifications rules. Only solution for all our problems is chanting of Nityananda, Gauranga and Hare Krsna Maha Mantra.

Person may have some theoretical knowledge about karma, vedic scriptures etc. but realm of bhakti is only attainable if we dive deep into Naam. Naam is only path and only goal. Everything is within Naam and our greatest happiness and good fortune is that we got this rarest opportunity to chant Holy Names. We are really fortunate! Sometimes we may think, at least I am such case, that everything else is more important than chanting. Recently I was deeply overburden with so many unsolved problems â€“ Oh you must work to maintain family and your salary is miserable, try to find better job, you are living in rented apartment, no money to pay bills, how to earn for your own house, you have health problems or problems with relatives etc. It is never ending story. We become so crazy that we are thinking that such madness is normal! What we are trying to do? We are trying to solve individual problems but â€“ surprise, there is always new one! So, if we want really to help ourselves, we must find solution for all our problems. What are we doing here? Where we actually belong? How to go there?

Such observations inspired me to approach to Naam Bhajan with some sincerity. Yes, mind is crazy, yes there are thousands unsolved problems, yes I do not have any quality, yes I may not be successful, yes it may take zillions of lives, but is there any other solution? Answer is no!

Ceto darpana marjanam bhava-mahadavagni nirvapanam

That is my position, and actually position of every conditioned soul â€“ we are in the middle of blazing fire â€“ mahadavagni â€“ we are burning and suffering in this cage. And my concesness is so dull that I do not actually understand how urgent this situation is! Ceto darpana marjanam, this process of chanting is so powerful that it will clear all dirt from our mind and then we will be able to see our image. I am thinking â€“ Oh I am this and that, such and such, but real self is hidden deep under tons of false identifications. Naam is only solution to this critical problem.

Presently I am chanting 16-16-16 rounds of Nityananda, Gauranga and Hare Krsna Maha Mantra. I had heard that Srila Prabhupada once said that he was practice, exercise, worked on his chanting for more then 30 years. That is great example. Chanting is gradual process and every person must understand that key word is practice. It was not clear to me for long time. Now I can understand a little â€“ chanting requires practice and dedication. Mercy is always here, but we need to make effort and practice our chanting. Success is achieved by many small steps. Every round is one small step toward our real happiness and our real position.

Thank -

44 Responses to “Diary of chanting aspirant [A] ” Reply Top

Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-01-19 13:24:17. Replies | Top | End | Reply

January 19.2007.

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada!
All glories to Srilla Prabhupada!

Chanting requires determination that whatever is happening we will somehow or other chant and finish our rounds. There are many obstacles, external or internal, but if person simply continue and chant everything will become auspicious. Sometimes I feel greatly inspire to chant and remembrance of Lord and His lilas is automatically there, but sometimes I am feeling tired, mind is revolting, concentration is weak, and then it is needful to make extra step, to push toward, to break inertia and dullness and surrender to Naam. And if we dedicate fully to this, Naam will give us strength and taste, and will energize us – nija sarva saktis – all energies are within Naam.

Today, while I was chanting Gaura Naam, just for moment within my mind I saw beautiful sad-bhuja form of Lord Gauranga. Just for few seconds I saw Sarvabhauma Bhatacarya who was offering dandavat before lotus feet of Lord Gauranga Mahaprabhu who was standing in sad-bhuja form. That was just a moment, but I felt so happy and jubilant by seeing this. That was just a drop of mercy, just a drop of nectar and Naam Prabhu mercifully gave me this few second of realization just to inspire me to chant more.

Gaura Naam is cintamani Naam. Gaura Naam is non-different from Lord Gauranga Mahaprabhu.Within Gaura Naam we can find all other Names and Forms of Lord, just like Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu manifested His Sad-bhuja form in Gaura lila. At the same moment only few devotes like Sarvabhauma Bhatacharya got this rarest opportunity to see and understand such hidden position of Lord Gauranga. That was His mercy. Similar, we are most fortunate because we got this rarest opportunity to chant Gaura Naam and on that way personally associate with Supreme Lord. Jei Gauranga nama loi tara hoi prema doy.

dhana mora nityananda
radha-krsna sri carana
Sei mora abharana

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Swami says:

2008-01-19 14:47:29. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna! Thank you for sharing. Gaura Naama easily imparts us with glimpses of the Lord...gauranga bhajana sarala ati, sahaja tahara phala vitati...Lord Shiva states to Parvati devi in Navadvipa Dhaama Mahatmya that Gauraanga Bhajana by chanting Gaura Naama is very easy and sublime and it gives results and fruits without much effort.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-01-19 15:47:27. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
Thank you, dear Gurudeva for your comment. Yes, that is perfect word - glimp. Just a moment, just a drop. That moment can not be properly described with mundane words, and it is not result of our effords but it is manifestation of causeless mercy.

atah sri-krsna-namadi
na bhaved grahyam indriyaih
sevonmukhe hi jivadau
svayam eva sphuraty adah
C.C. Madhya-lila 17.136

"'Therefore material senses cannot appreciate Krsna’s holy name, form, qualities and pastimes. When a conditioned soul is awakened to Krsna consciousness and renders service by using his tongue to chant the Lord's holy name and taste the remnants of the Lord's food, the tongue is purified, and one gradually comes to understand who Krsna really is.'

Then sadhaka only want to chant more and dive into Naam. Everything else looks useless and empty. Now I am sitting at my working desk thinking that I am here simply vasting my time. hari hari biphale janama gonainu

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-01-20 17:35:32. Replies | Top | End | Reply

January 20.2007.

It is so nice to chant in the early morning. Mind is calm, whole atmosphere is very auspicious and chanting is like nectar. Unfortunately for average working and busy grhastha (grhamedhi) on west it is very hard to manage to rise up early everyday because so called obligations and duties requires from person to go to sleep after midnight. Simple living high thinking. How necessary this is for devotee. I am living complicated , stressful life within complicated society and to dedicate to Naam person needs just opposite. Simple things are wonderful. This society needs simplicity.

I have habit to mentally chant and pray before Tota-Gopinatha Deity and I am feeling that there is real peace and home. Many times while my mind is flickering and not calm I am visualizing to chant before Lord or that I am sitting on the shores of Yamuna/Puri ocean where my hearth belongs. I am praying to my Lord to bless me so that in next life I may be born like insignificant insect in Tota Gopinatha's temple

gopinath, ami ki dose dosi
asura sakala, pailo carana,
vinoda thakilo bosi'

Gopinatha, I am so sinful that although all the demons attained Your lotus
feet, Bhaktivinoda has remained in worldly existence.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-01-22 09:06:18. Replies | Top | End | Reply

January 22.2008.

There is interesting definition of word aspirant - a seeker after spiritual knowledge, one who aspires to develop love for God. We all are seekers for Krsna, spiritual travelers. But road is dark and we are walking on narrow path. Only light is Naam.

Today I realized that Naam Bhajan is not easy. It is not possible artificially to imitate advanced stages of Naam Bhajan. We may have desire; we should strive to chant constantly, and some day we will be successful in our endeavors.

Presently my chanting, enthusiasm and concentration is flickering, one day I am feeling completely absorb in sadhana and Naam, other day I am overwhelm with material concesness, desires and struggles. It is necessary to attain position of stability in devotional practice, and maybe it is life long task for me.

Sometimes Naam is giving me small drops of nectar just to show me that i should fight more and chant more. Sometimes I am feeling that I can really do it, sometimes I am feeling helpless.

gopinath, sakali tomara maya
nahi mama bala, jnana sunirmala,
swadhina nahe e kaya

This is so deep verse. Sakali tomara maya. Everywhere around me there is your illusory energy, O lord! And I have no strength, no knowledge, nothing. And I am far from being free from earthly temptations. That is my position.

Where is solution and relief?

harer nama harer nama harer nama iva kevalam
kalau nasty eva nasty eva nasty eva gatir anyatha

Naam is only solution.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-01-23 11:31:23. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Well, today my chanting was extremely poor. Mind is sometimes so strong in crazy desire not to chant, not to listen, to do whatever else is possible. Krsna said in Bhagavad gita man-mana bhavo that we must absorb our mind and surrender to Him. That is not easy task.
I am rebel, charlatan and jiva that want to imitate Supreme Lord. Illusion that I can be Enjoyer or Controller are deeply within my hearth and mind is struggling so hard to keep me under maya's control. Bhaja hurey mana, sri nanda nandana, awake o mind, and worship son of Nanda Maharaja, only then you will attain happiness and become fearless.
Chanting is process. I will have many ups and downs. Slow and steady. This life may end any moment or I may live for 50 years more. It doesn't matter. While I am on this chanting path I am safe while torments and storms are on any other place.

I have mixed devotion. Karma misra, jnjana misra and who knows how many other impurities within hearth. Is there any quality? Only hope and faith in Nityananda and Gauranga Naam. I do not have strong faith in chanting Hare Krsna Maha Mantra alone, because I am offender and I would be crushed down by severe reactions. I am not able to overcome 10 offences in chanting Hare Krsna. I am chanting Hare Krsna for more then 15 years and I can say that real advancement in chanting only Hare Krsna requires completely surrender, chanting lakh of Names, living on holy place, not associate with materialistic persons. So many things if person is serious about chanting. If not, how will sadhaka overcome Naam aparadhas. Practically speaking that is not possible. That is my realization.

Only very rare souls may live in material world and chant pure Hari Naam, but for conditioned and fallen soul like me, it is not possible. I would like to be opposite, but that is reality. So what to do? My only hope is chanting of Nitaai and Gaura Naam. Nothing else. That is only that I can do. I can not follow arcane, pancaratrika system, detailed rules, tapasya etc. So fallen position. Lower then sudra and candala. Crazy mind, crazy senses, no knowledge or proper behavior. Nothing. Now I know why Nitaai and Gaura Naam manifested Themselves in this world. To save most fallen of fallen.

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Bhakta Matus says:

2008-01-23 19:42:48. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Dear Igor,
Nityananda! Gauranga! Hare Krishna! Please accept my humble obeisances.

Thank You for Your diary. It is a very valuable contribution for us, daily practitiners of Naam Bhakti Yoga.

i very much share Your latest post with You:

[quote]My only hope is chanting of Nitaai and Gaura Naam. Nothing else. That is only that I can do. I can not follow arcane, pancaratrika system, detailed rules, tapasya etc. So fallen position. Lower then sudra and candala. Crazy mind, crazy senses, no knowledge or proper behavior. Nothing. Now I know why Nitaai and Gaura Naam manifested Themselves in this world. To save most fallen of fallen.[/quote]
i feel completely same and that forces me to more and more appreciate the great treasure of Nityananda Gauranga Naam. Actually my whole so-called sadhana, perserverance and any strength i gather to continue with Naam Bhakti Yoga is based upon one single verse, namely:

caitanya-nityaanande naahi esaba vichaara
naama laite prema dena, vahe ashrudhaara

"But if one only chants, with some slight faith, the holy names of Lord Caitanya and Nityaananda, very quickly he is cleansed of all offenses. Thus as soon as he chants the Hare Kṛṣṇa mahaa-mantra, he feels the ecstasy of love for God."

If this verse wasn't there, i don't know how i would walk on the path of Bhakti Yoga, the kind of aparadhi and sinner i am. It is so much life giving. i get hope against hope, that as long as i continue to daily and with my best intention chanting the Holy Names of Nityaananda and Gauraanga, Their Lordships will definitely cast Their side-long glace upon me sooner or later, irrespective of how fallen and unqualified i am. Yes, Lord Nityaananda is definitely the saviour of the most degraded souls and as long as one chants His Holy Name and the Name of His Lord Gauranga, He will surely deliver that soul. He has shown it already in the case of Jagai and Madhai, in which category i also belong. So please Nitaai! Underpin Your Glories as the Deliverer of the most fallen and deliver me!

doya koro more nitai, doya koro more
agatira gati nitai sadhu loke bole

"O my Nitai, please shower your mercy on me. All sadhus say, "You are so merciful, You give the right destination to the fallen souls."

You and Your Holy Name is my only hope and ground, on which i am able to stand and walk in order to do Your Bhakti. You are the ultimate shelter for this lost and forlorn soul.

Your lost and fallen servant,
Matus

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-01-24 08:57:08. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Yes, you are completely right. Thank you so much for sharing dear Matus. This is true - I am not able to chant Hari Naam and that only link to Naam Prabhu, is Nitaai and Gaura Naam. We are in that position, as you said that we are fully depending upon sweet mercy of Lord Nityananda.

O Lord,
You gave sublime medicine
In form of Hari Naam

Jaggai and Madhai
Attained highest devotion
Simply by taking this cure

But, alas,
I am so sinful and fallen
That sweetness of Your Name
Looks bitter for me

How You will cure
Burning fewer of aparadhas
In my stone hearth?

This fallen servant
Is shouting
O Nitai! O Gaura!
Your Own Names are the only hope.

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Swami says:

2008-01-25 15:47:45. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna! Thank you so much Igor for this spontaneous poem. :) It would be great if you can post a separate topic in your forum about each of your writings and realizations instead of all in one topic so further discussion on each of your writings could be continued in one place. Also the new titles of each topic would encourage more readers.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-05 07:54:26. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Today I was reading Swami's realizations about chanting in dham - Tears in Navadvipa and I started to think - yes, this is what I want, this is life that I want, life of devotion. How to attain this service, how to attain devotion?Answer is - Naam.

Then I realised that I should chant Naam because that will please my Gurudeva and Krsna. If I can force/manage/subdue myself to dedicate to Naam more and more, somehow or other in future gradually try to attain level of 64/64/64 rounds per day that will please Gurudeva most.

Frankly, I do not see any other possible way what I should do. I am born in non-vedic family, purity, pancaratrika-vidhi, sanskrit, philosophy, jnjana, vedic rituals - it is all not familiar to me, nor that I have any attraction to this. My goal is simple - chanting Naam and I am hoping that will please my Gurudeva.

Very often I am complicated, but I know that is byproduct of this western heritage, we have this tendency to complicate things. But in fact, this is simple, just chant Naam, really surrender to Naam and all perfection will be there.

I know that I am learning, slowly, mostly on mistakes. Very often I am founding myself that I am completely incapable to understand or practice devotional activities fully, but then I have picture of Swami Gaurangapada and some strenght to continue is automatically there - Yes, I want to be like this person, like my guru, I want also to chant and understand what is bhakti, to do something positive with this life.

To reach goal of chanting 100.000 Names daily is gigantic task for person like me. Mountains of false ego, crazy mind, and not evan one good quality. Only some sradha that I will get some unconditional mercy from Gurudeva. I am only making problems to Him, bothering and asking some irrelevant questions, pretending to be devotee, speak some non-sence. I am not have determination or strength. But, anyway I have small faith that if I somehow or other manage always to stay around him, I will become purified and gradually, someday I may chant nicely. It is possible to transform iron into gold. Association of pure devotee is the key.

So, today I decided to write this short entry into diary of chanting aspirant. That is right definition. Aspirant. Student. Beginner. This whole process is based on mercy. Guru-krsna prasade paya bhakti lata bija. Guru-krpa...mercy of guru is everything. I do not know how to get, earn, steal this mercy, I am making many mistakes but still have faith that simply by trying, somehow or other I will get drop of mercy from my Gurudeva. then, and only if he give me his mercy, I will be able to chant someday 100.000. Names daily in complete absorption in Naam, Form, Pastimes etc. That is goal of life, everything else is secondary.

While reading Tears in Navadvipa, such thoughts came to me today.

ekaki amara, nahi paya bala,
hari-nama-sankirtane
tumi kṛpa kori', sraddha-bindu diya,
deho' krsna-nama-dhane

"I do not find the strength to carry on alone the sankirtana of the holy name of Hari. Please bless me by giving me just one drop of faith with which to obtain the great treasure of the holy name of Krsna."

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Damodara Svarupa Dasa says:

2008-06-06 07:03:21. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda, Gauranga, Hare Krishna.
Jaya Guru Parampara, Jaya Swamiji Gaurangapada!
Dandavats to all the Vaishnanvas.

Dear Bhakta Igor,

Chanting and praying is very essential indeed if one wants to find God. As you, I too am not born into this Vedic tradition and have different views on the teachings of the Guru Parampara. But here's a story from the desert fathers which I hope will inspire you. Once there was a monk who went to see his Father Abbot and told him: “Dear Father, I find I’m not at all fit to live in the monastery. I sin all the time and I can’t do all the prayers and monastic duties. I must confess that I’m not a good brother after all and must ask you, Father Abbot, to leave this house immediately.” The Father Abbot looked at him, smiled and said: “We fall and stand up. We fall and stand up. We fall and stand up again…” The brother looked at the Abbot, understood his profound message and remained in the monastery.

For those people not living in a monastery, who are married and have job, things are much, much harder. Getting to a level of chanting 100.000 Names per day is not at all an easy task. A day only has 24 hours. Count 8 hours per day of work (plus an extra hour or two on the road just to there and home again). Chanting a pure 100.000 Names takes well over 8 hours. And humans do need their sleep. So if you’re married and are a householder, when do you have the time to do the necessary chores and spend some time with the family? When do you even have the time to catch up reading the Acarya’s books? And contemplate on their teachings? And pray to God? I don’t live in a monastery, so I try to work out a good balance between all these matters and know that as long as I need to go to work (to maintain my family), I won’t make it to chant 100.000 Names per day. God knows about my intentions and He will decide upon my sincerity and my actions. He knows I’m desperately seeking Him and that my life is in His Hands.

Humbly aspiring to be a true yet simple devotee of our Lord,
Damodara Svarupa dasa

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-06 09:38:30. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna,
thank you so much for your words. Story is really inspirative and I am finding myself in this case. Yes, we all are learning, we fall and stand up.
Regarding that there is one proverb. Question is what is difference between winer and loser? Answer is very simple...only difference is that winner is always get up when he fall, and looser quite after first difficulty. Nice story.

Yes, I agree with you and whatever you said about household life. That is true. It is not easy to have spiritual tendencies and in the same time live in material enviorement. All your arguments are sober and wellwishing for me.

There is struggle within me because going to job, associating with materialistic persons and doing all kind of activities just to earn small amount of money to pay bills seems to me like vasting of precious time. Frankly, I see little or no sense in this "struggle for existence." I am trying to play that role, best I can, but simultaneously I am praying to Lord Nityananda to help me to overcome such entanglements and live simple and sublime life, absorb in devotional service and Naam.

Chanting of 100.000 Names is life time goal. There is great example of Our Acharya Srilla Bhaktivinoda Thakura. He spent his last years fully absorb in Naam. That is goal. Due to my ugra-karma and previous offencess I am suffering in separation from vaishnavas, guru, Dham and Lord, but Lord Nityananda is most merciful upon all, including greatest fools and sinners.

I think I love my family members,(or trying to love them and take care best I can ) and because I am attached to them I want only best for them. How may I give them ultimate benefit? Is it on material level? That is just one side of coin - I must provide food, shelter etc. That is external. But if I am really care about them, then I must help them to leave this material realm and live eternal happy life.What is use if I manage to build golden castle for my son if he must suffer in material world? So, I do not see any other think to do it but to chant Naam, and hopefully in this life time attain stage of 100.000. Names per day. That is best thing that I may do for ultimate benefit for my family. All other things and arrangements will perish due to course of time, spiritual benefit will remain.

Off course, to think like that, and more to act like that in modern world means to be complete idiot according to materialistic measurements. We all are crazy according to material standards. You are chanting? You are reading some books? What are you doing? But as Srilla Prabhupada wrote in his wonderful essay question is - Who is crazy? Who really understand nature of this place? This is temporary place. We are reading this post now, for 100 years none of us will be here, in this body. That is fact. Are we really aware of this fact? Therefore, chanting of Naam is more important then our life-force. Our spiritual activities are our only wealth. It is not theory, that is practical.

Sorry for writing so long post. I just wanted to explain. We all are unique persons. Some of us need to live in grhastha, some of us in vanaprastha, sanyasa asram, whatever. It is not so important. It is external. We all know in hearth what is best for us. Most important is our understanding and practice of Naam-tattva, whenever we may be. This life is short. Who knows how long we will be in this body? Some may say that these are hard words, but it is reality.

Thank you for your words and story. Please continue to helping me on this path. That is real treasure of vaisnava sanga.

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

artificial devotee, Igor

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Damodara Svarupa Dasa says:

2008-06-09 11:18:57. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda, Gauranga, Hare Krishna.
Jaya Guru Parampara, Jaya Swamiji Gaurangapada.
Dandavats to all the Vaishnavas.

Dear Bhakta Igor,

As for the struggle of your job, well, I do understand what you’re saying. I myself write many lines of computer code per day and to what end? With the recent food and fuel prices, extra taxes and so on, there’s not much left to make a ‘decent’ living. We work for a consumer driven society and suffer the consequences of it. At least, that’s one way of thinking about it. The other way is that whatever I do, I offer it to the Lord. If I don’t know the real utility of the work I’m doing, He’ll know it for sure and will sort things out. If I just walk from point A to point B, I offer it to the Lord. This way, ‘walking’ always makes sense. Whatever tiny the thing you’re doing, offer it to God first and be content with the rest.

About the family members: it has to be their choice if they want to follow you on your quest to God. Lord Caitanya Himself told his disciples to just spread the Name, go from door to door but continue to spread the Name. Whether the people accept it or not depends on so many things. But, after all, it is their choice and they have to live up against the consequences of their choices. I talk about God to my children. But right now, they have different phases to go through. If they don’t listen to me now, perhaps later on they’ll remember what I’ve told them and continue their own quest… But that doesn’t mean I’ll love them less if they choose a different path.

I suppose you’ve already read Svalikhita Jivani? If not, please read for yourself about Shrila Bhaktivinoda’s quest to God. He too had to find a balance between spiritual and material life while he had to go to work. And as a householder, I try to do just the same…

Humbly trying to be a true devotee of the Lord,
Damodara Svarupa dasa

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-09 13:04:19. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Yes, that is exatly situation and problems that I am presently dealing with. Well, from one point it is not so easy to attain position of 100% devotional service. I look at this situation as test of faith. If Lord wants, He may help me to reach Him and His pure devotees. Anyway I am not deserved such association and acctualy I am in gain, because I somehow or other came in contact with His Holy Names and pure devotees.

I did not read full version of Svalikhita Jivan and I will do it for sure. Thank you for mentioned this. Yes, you are right, we should walk from A to B to C etc. It is all right to have high expetations, or desires, but we need time and we need to become serious and mature in our devotion. Everything is under Lord's control. If I may alweys be aware of this fact, then there is no place for sorow or weakness.

Thank you sooo much for sharing this with me. It is so important to have such correspodence among devotees because we are looking sometimes from different angles, and helping each other to solve important problems.

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Your's Igor

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Swami says:

2008-06-10 03:23:26. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna! Thank you Igor and Damodara Svarupa dasa for sharing your practical and intimate realizations regarding chanting of the Holy Names. Such discussions are always useful since they pertain to the important topic of increasing the quality or quantity of our Naama Bhajana. Even if may not be able to reach the standard of chanting 100,000 Holy Names daily with quality (deep meditation) in this life, simply accepting that order of the Supreme Lord Gauranga Mahaprabhu as our ultimate ideal for chanting, will please the Lord, since we will keep His order on our heads with great respect even though we may not be able to implement it due to practical considerations.

Regarding the Sva Likhita Jivani "autobiography" supposedly to be written Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura, I personally do not accept all it's contents as authentic. So do some of the Gurus in our line. It is supposed to originally be a 200-page prose letter written to his son, Lalita Prasad Datta, who requested the details of his father's personal life. As we know, Lalita Prasad had more of a conception of Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura as his family father than that of an Acharya and Pure Devotee unlike Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada who always considered Shrila Bhaktivinoda Thakura as an eternal associate of the Lord. This letter was later obtained from Lalita Prasad and was printed by the Gaudiya Mission after the disappearance of Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada so the letter itself and even the publishing of the letter was not directly authorized by Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada.

The nature of this letter is anti-hagiographical. Of course, it is possible that Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura being extremely humble can write like that about himself and may have wrote parts of this Sva Likhita Jivani letter but if devotees who are not very advanced in understanding Shrila Bhaktivinoda Thakura's eternal constitutional position as Kamala Manjari, read this letter, then they may unwillingly or willingly commit grave offenses against one of the greatest Mahabhagavata devotee in modern times and put their spiritual lives at risk.

For this reason, it is highly recommended that a devotee should never read anti-hagiographical articles or books about great devotees which display them as ordinary human beings with a mundane conception since they are eternal associates of the Lord. The authors of Vaishnava books and especially biographies should be very very careful not to present even a slightest conception of mundanism in the lives of the pure devotees because we cannot understand and thus should never try to interpret the elevated actions of the pure devotees. I am sure that even if Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura would have written parts of this letter, he would not have wanted the whole world to read it because it was sent only to his son only on the son's very specific request. Also, all parts of this letter in it's present form cannot be accepted as the bona-fide writings of Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura as this letter was never authorized by Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada in it's entirety.

We cannot understand the spiritual actions of Pure Devotees so how can we ever understand those day-to-day practical actions by Pure Devotees which may externally look like our own karma-influenced actions which we perform while struggling in this material world. We may end up confusing the pure devotees on our same level. For this reason, the lives of the pure devotees have never been described in an anti-hagiographical manner in any of Gaudiya scriptures written by our Acharyas. I wanted to write about this issue for some time so I am glad it came up for discussion. Thank you.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Damodara Svarupa Dasa says:

2008-06-10 12:05:06. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda, Gauranga, Hare Krishna.

Thank You for your concern on the Svalikhita Jivani.

Personally, I don’t understand what an “anti-hagiographical work” can do wrong if it sticks to the truth? In general, hagiographies tend to ‘stretch’ the truth to some extend. But then again, the truth is in the eye of the beholder, and everyone looks at the truth in his own way.

Even without this so called biography, just looking at the pictures of Shrila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, it isn’t hard to conclude that there really are a lot of pictures from Him and his family. There are not many people, born in the 19^th century, who left such a vast amount of pictures. There aren’t many people born in the 19^th century, who left such a vast amount of knowledge in the form of books and teachings either.

>>For this reason, the lives of the pure devotees have never been described in an anti-hagiographical manner in any of Gaudiya scriptures written by our Acharyas.<<

This really is a pity, as it denies us from learning about the Acharyas on yet another level. All we now know is that they are saints. But we do not know nor learn how they became a saint. And this process could help many devotees on their way to God.

Damodara Svarupa dasa

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Swami says:

2008-06-10 12:48:17. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna! I can understand what you are saying Damodara Svarupa dasa. But what if it does not stick to the truth? I don't want to go into the details but this published form of Sva Likhita Jivani does not seem to stick to the truth only. There is a great possibility that certain parts have been added later which are fabrication and offensive to Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura. And in other general cases, what if there are mundane intepretations of the actions of a pure devotee by that author? That would not be the truth either. How can the an ordinary author intepret the mind and heart of a pure devotee? na martya buddhayusyeta....It is said in the Shrimad Bhagavatam that an Acharya should not seen or understood with material vision or interpretation or understanding since he is the personification of all the demigods...vaishnavera vakya kriya mudra vigyeya na bujhaya...It is described in Shri Chaitanya Charitamrita that even the most learned and advanced person cannot comprehend the actions of a pure devotee, what to speak of trying to interpret them.

Thus, ideally an Acharya's hagiographical biography should be written by another devotee on the same perfected platform or most carefully by an advanced devotee leaving out any anti-hagiographical interpretations about the actions of the pure devotee. An Associate of the Lord is so perfect that it is never a stretch of his glories to glorify him extensively and hagiographically. An hagiographical biography is the minimum which could be done to properly present the glories of pure devotees which are beyond our comprehension.

[quote]This really is a pity, as it denies us from learning about the Acharyas on yet another level. All we now know is that they are saints. But we do not know nor learn how they became a saint. And this process could help many devotees on their way to God.[/quote]

A factual and highly respectful hagiographical biography of an Acharya's pastimes in this world would certainly tell us about how he became a saint (great soul) for our own inspiration but without mundane interpretations and extrapolations. It will never try to interpret their activities or impose wrong activities in their character. It is such biographies which are the utmost nourishing and inspiring for our soul. I hope this helps.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Venkat says:

2008-06-11 07:06:03. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krishna!
Dear Igor Prabhu,
Your articles of your Naam bhajan, personal life and problems are really very inspiring. Most of us face the same problems. Take me for example—I am born in a South Indian Smarta family. My family never used to accept the ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada. Ever since I read the Bhagavat Gita As It Is, I have always been wanting to visit the ISKCON and associate with devotees. But in my family it was completely taboo. Sometimes huge arguments used to occur with other relatives saying “your son will be brainwashed by the ISKCON. They will make him a sanyaasi, etc”. At one point of time I completely lost hope. I have even cried to Srila Prabhupada to help me. Turbulent times those were. But then Krishna is the maintainer of all living entities. Factually nothing is in our hands. Srila Prabhupada once said very nicely in a Srimad Bhagavatam lecture (Bombay, November 2, 1974) ---

““So all these jivas, we, living entities, we are being maintained by that one. This is the Vedic information. Eko bahunam yo vidadhati kaman. Just like we maintain our family. One man is earning, and he is maintaining his family, wife, children, servants, dependents, workers, so many. Similarly, that one, Bhagavan, is maintaining all the living entities. You do not know how many there are. In Africa there are millions of elephants. They are also eating forty kg's at one time. So that, they are also being maintained. And the small ant, that is also being maintained. There are 8,400,000 forms of different bodies. Who is maintaining them? Maintaining, Bhagavan, that ekah. Eko bahunam yo vidadhati kaman. That is a fact. So why He'll not maintain us? Especially those who are devotees, who have taken shelter at the lotus feet of the Supreme Lord, leaving aside everything simply for His service.

Just like in our Krsna consciousness movement. We have got more than one hundred centers. And one center... We were just reading from the statement of Nava Bharata Times how they are well managed. But we have no business. We have no source of income. That is the only source of income -- Krsna's shelter. Samasrita ye pada-pallava-plavam. Therefore sastra says that "You take shelter of Krsna." Krsna comes also to say the same truth. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. He never said that "You do this and do that. Then I shall give you for your maintenance." No. Aham tvam sarva-papebhyo moksayisyami: "Not only I shall give maintenance, but I shall protect you from the resultant action of sinful life." So much assurance is there. So sastra also says, tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovido na labhyate yad bhramatam upary adhah [SB 1.5.18]. Tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovidah. Kovida means intelligent, very intelligent person. So what should he try for? Tasyaiva hetoh: to get shelter at the lotus feet of Krsna. Human life should only endeavor how to get in touch of the lotus feet of Krsna. That should be the only one business.””

So what can we do? We cannot give the love of Godhead to others. We can however be a mode of distribution of that love. Everything depends on Gauranga’s mercy. If Gaurasundara wishes he can give anyone prema, even a rat. Actually we put ourselves in anxiety when we think that we are the cause. No, rather the cause is and always Krishna. The only thing we can do is to increase our naama bhajana. The better you do your chanting the more you will see things change around you. I have had practical experience of this. Now my brother and my father chant. Of course for their chanting is not regular but atleast they accept. Before my father would not. My mother has not accepted yet but I hope, by Nitaai’s mercy, she will. I have seen that no amount of reasoning will change people if Gaura’s mercy is not there. But with His mercy even the impossible will take place.

The best experience I have had of Gaura’s mercy is my next door neighbor. She is too, a Smarta brahmin. One day she was taking with my mother about Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. I was dumbstruck! I have never spoken to her about these. But then it seems she had bought a Tamil version of the Chaitanya Bhagavata and had read it. She is now so attracted by that book. She was telling my mum—“Mami (that’s how smarta ladies are call each other in Tamil), Chaitaya Mahaprabhu is such a great mahan. It is said that he is an avatara of Lord Krishna. His pastimes as Nimaai is so super excellent.” That day I felt so elated. She has even accepted all the associates of Mahaprabhu. She now chants the mahamantra. She gave that book to mum and though my mum hasn’t read it fully she has now accepted Mahaprabhu. She is still reluctant to chant though. Things have changed completely ever since I started chanting the holy names Nityaananda Gauranga. Now my parents have finally (for now) accepted that I am not maintaining any close contact with the ISKCON and that I visit it only to attend the kirtans and have prasada in the Sunday feast. I have even told them I have close contact with Hadai prabhu and they said nothing (Nitaai’s mercy). Now by His grace I do not have much opposition from my family. And I have hope that one day they will all accept the holy names Nityaananda Gauranga.

Even my friend Srinath has had that experience. His mother has read the Navadwipa Dhaama Mahatmya. Now his mother and his grandfather are chanting.

There is only one thing I realize from these. The only thing we need to be anxious about is chanting and how to increase the quantity and quality; and how to please Vaishnavas. Nothing else. The rest is all Gauranga’s work. He’ll take care of everything. We are incapable of doing anything else than pleasing Him and His devotees. Food, shelter, every possession we have, even this body, is given by Him. So we can only surrender to His lotus feet.

Although I have yapped so much, the fact is even I am not perfect (an idiot when it comes to practical matters). Being in a middle class family, I too feel anxious about the rising prices. But what can we do? I only pray to Gauranga to protect me.

The above things I have talked are what I learnt from Hadai prabhu when I used to moan about my parents attitude. He gave me courage by telling me his own story. I fall at his feet and thank him for bringing sense to this fool. Please correct me if I have committed any offence.

Aspiring to serve and please Vaishnavas,

The biggest fool on the planet,
Venkat

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-11 08:04:34. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Dear Venkatji, thank you so much for your words. You are right -" The only thing we need to be anxious about is chanting and how to increase the quantity and quality; and how to please Vaishnavas. Nothing else." That is supreme formula for attaining succes in life.

Sometimes it is hard for me to understand that many Indian borm persons do not accept Lord Gauranga and devotional service. To be born in Bharata-varsa is great advantage, with little or no efford person may get everything for devotional progress.

Story about your neibhour and Mum is really inspirative. Lord Gauranga's Holy Name is cintamani, touchstone of the soul. We are very fortunate to get this rarest oportynity to chant Nityananda and Gauranga Mantrarajas and on that way bring greatest benefit for our families and humanity in large.

Thank you for sharing Prabhupada's words with me. I realised that I am too much in fear of "what will be if would be", and that this is just lack of faith that Lord is Supreme Controlor and Friend. Taking shelter of Naam is again - only solution. All roads are leading to Naam.

I have accepted my possition as punishment for unlimited aparadhas and sinfull activities from past lives, but Lord is so mercifull that He gave me oportynity to listen about Him, to read about His activities, to came in contact with His pure representative Our Gurudeva Swami Gaurangapada and to at least try to practice this sublime process. Therefore we are most fortunate.

I also want humbly to ask you to please give me your blessings so that someday I may serve Gurudeva on some usefull way, and chant Naam nicely. Vaisnavas are desire-trees and if somehow or other we may get their blessings, our life may become perfect.

Thank you so much for your words. I will try to surrender more to Naam. That is ultimate solution for all our problems.

hoping to become servant of devotees, Igor

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-11 09:38:14. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Regarding Sva Likhita Jivani topic under this thread: For any reader and devotee, here is very detailed text written by Swami Gaurangapada:

"Independently Thoughtful" And Anti-Hagiography "

where you can find additional explanations.

Thank you Bhakta Matus for giving me link of this amasing explanation. Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

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Swami says:

2008-06-11 14:53:44. Replies | Top | End | Reply

"Independently Thoughtful" And Anti-Hagiography
By Bhaktiratna Sadhu Swami.
January 10, 2003.

Apart from the pure bhakti movement of accepting all the activities of our pure Acharyas as fully transcendental, there have arisen two speculated and greatly dangerous schools of thought when it comes to analysing the life and behaviours of our Acharyas. One school believes in hagiographical aspect of the saints, in seeing only their divine aspects (which means that they have a doubt that there is a non-divine aspect too but ignore it), while other school believe in seeing the bonafide Acharyas especially their writings and activities sometimes from a mundane perspective, seeing them as human in some ways, with all the human characteristics with all its imperfections. In a sense they say that the great Acharyas are not always perfect, and may sometimes make mistakes, or have the same troubles that we, the conditioned living entities have.

This is actually the greatest danger, and many older devotees are falling into this trap. Sometimes it goes on under the name "Independently Thoughful." Shrila Prabhupada's words "independently thoughtful" are being to justify the discussion of seeing some faults in Shrila Prabhupada himself or the previous acharyas. This will invite total disaster. One book was published recently depicting the life and teachings of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, but from a total mundane perspective. Thus the Acharya was sometimes seen as someone who would or had engaged in sinful activities before he attained his saintlyhood. This is the greatest offense.

Just like the glorification and worship of the pure devotee Acharyas is advocated by the Lord even before His own worship, the belittlement of the glories of the Acharyas even if in very subtle ways is even more harmful and deleterious for the human society than the direct criticism of the Lord.

If the human society or any society for that matter allows or does not stop the public offenses towards the great self-realized Acharyas, that society will be totally and disastrously ruined due to the wrath of the Lord Himself.

mahantera apamana ye desa-grame haya eka janara dose saba desa ujadaya (Cc Antya 3.165)

"Wherever an pure self-realized devotee is insulted, minimized or belittled, for one man's fault the entire town, city, country or place is ruined and destroyed."

prabhu bale, vaisnava nindaye yei jana
kustharoga kon tara shatiye likhana
apatatah sastri kichu haiyache matra
ara kata ache yama-yatanara patra
caurasi sahasra yama-yatana pratyekse
punah punah kari" bunje vaisnava-nindake

Lord Gauranga Mahaprabhu said, "It is written that one who blasphemes, criticizes, minimizes or belittles the pure Vaishnavas will suffer from leprosy, after which he will be punished by the agents of Yamaraja again and again, and after which he will suffer tremendous tribulation while accepting thousands of births in the 8.4 million species of life. (Cb. Madhya 4.375-377)

bhrama, pramada, vipralipsa, karanapatava
arsa-vijna-vakye nahi dosa ei saba (Cc Adi 2.86)

"Mistakes, illusions, cheating and defective perception never occur in the sayings and activities of the self-realized authoritative sages even in their normal behaviour.(everything they do is perfect)"

Even the very thought about the idea of such a mundane perpective about a pure devotee is the beginning of total ruination in spiritual life. It is a very vicious anartha which can totally destroy the bhakti-lata-bija. It is an offense of trying to bring the maha-bhagavata down to one's own level of conditioned life.

Shrila Jiva Goswami explains in the Sandarbhas that the aging, disappearance apparent limitations or troubles in the life of a pure devotee are simply illusory tricks conjured by Maya to bewilder others from receiving the mercy of the pure devotees and facilitate others to go to hell by committing offenses against the pure devotees. It is just an external display of the illusory energy because the bodies of the acharyas and eternal associates of the Lord are full transcendental as they have descended directly from the Lord's lila to fulfill His mission in the material world and thus there is no question of any kind of limitations or four kinds of the above defects in them like we see in the life of the nitya-baddha conditioned souls.

Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada says in some place that it is an offense not to accept a nitya-siddha as a nitya-siddha or to accept a nitya-siddha as a sadhana-siddha or to accept a sadhana-siddha as a nitya-siddha.

Some Prabhupada's quotes:

gaurangera sangi-gane, nitya-siddha kari' mane,
se yaya vrajendra-suta pasa

"One who accepts the associates of Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu as nitya-siddhas is certain to be elevated to the spiritual kingdom to become an associate of the Supreme Lord."

"One who is intelligent understands that all the personal associates and devotees of Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu are ever liberated. This means that because they are always engaged in the devotional service of the Lord, they do not belong to this material world. One who is engaged in the Lord's devotional service twenty-four hours daily and never forgets the Lord is called nitya-siddha."

"This is the position of nitya-siddha associates. Sri Narottama dasa Thakura therefore sings: gaurangera sangi-gane nitya-siddha kari mane. Every devotee should know that all the associates of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu-His family members, friends and other associates-were all nitya-siddhas. A nitya-siddha never forgets the service of the Lord. He is always engaged, even from childhood, in worshiping the Supreme Personality of Godhead."

>One school beleives in hagiographical aspect of the saints, in seeing only >their divine aspects,

Even the first school is quite off the mark because there is nothing except full divinity in the life and pastimes of the nitya-siddha devotees.

Even a least bit of doubt about the full divinity of the maha-bhagavatas can create an avalanche of doubts and confusions among the followers. If one cannot understand some points in the Acharya's books, one should go and understand it personally from an advanced devotee who has implicit faith in the words of the Acharyas. Such a devotee will surely be able to give an explanation to our doubts because simply by implicit faith in Guru and Gauranga all the imports of the Veidc scriptures are automatically revealed.

That is why even if such doubts arise in the minds of some sadhakas due to lack of proper sadhana or advancement they should be addressed and solved by personal and private counselling with advanced devotees rather then venting them out publicly and creating total chaos in the lives of the simple, sincere and faithful devotees in the name of so-called bogus independent thinking.

If so-called independent thoughtfulness is the cause for creating doubts in our minds and hearts about the great nitya-siddhas, then such independent thoughtfulness is the greatest obstacle and anartha and has to be immediately rejected to save us from elongating our miserable journey in the 8.4 million species of life. Lord Gauranga Mahaprabhu said that if someone maintains even a drop of doubt about Lord Nityananda or Lord Advaita, such a person will never get My mercy. This also applies to Lord Gauranga's pure devotees who have come down to accomplish His mission in this world.

It is better if atleast the word "human-like" is used in place of "human" to describe the activities of the Acharyas also, just like we do for Krishna's or Gauranga's lila. Because a pure devotee's body is spiritual and all of the activities of the great Acharyas are never human at all as per the Padma Purana and Shrimad-Bhagavatam.

na karma-bandhanam janma vaisnavanam ca vidyate
visnur anucaratvam hi moksam ahur manisinah

"A Vaisnava does not take birth under the jurisdiction of karmic law. His birth and disappearance are transcendental. The wise have declared that the pure servants of Lord Krishna are eternally engaged in the liberated service of the Lord and hence are free from the laws of material nature." (Hari-Bhakti-Vilasa, 10,113, quoted from Padma Purana)

acaryam mam vijaniyan navanmanyeta karhicit
na martya-buddhyasuyeta sarva-deva-mayo guruh

"One should verily know the Acharya as Myself and never disrespect him in any way. One should not envy him, thinking him as an human being of this material world (martya), for he is the representative of all the demigods." (SB 11.17.27)

The word whimsical has the following meanings as per the AHD:

1. Appealing to fancy:
a. fantastic
b. imaginative
c. fancy
d. fanciful

2. Determined or marked by whim or caprice rather than reason:
a. random
b. arbitrary
c. capricious
d. chance
e. willful

3. Following no predictable pattern:
a. variable
b. uncertain
c. unstable
d. changeable
e. inconsistent
f. volatile
g. erratic
h. unpredictable
i. unsteady
j. capricious
k. fickle
l. freakish
m. mercurial
n. inconstant
o. temperamental

Most of it's meanings (if not all of them) are in a derogatory sense.

My opinion is that if a word can be used in a derogatory sense it should never be used to describe a pure devotee because if people take it in that sense they are doomed.

Also what does one mean when one says "Acharya's humanness"? Does one mean that the acharya has some incompleteness or imperfection? Because humanness is normally associated in most cases with tendency to err and make mistakes.

(to err is human) The point is one should be very careful what impression we give to the readers especially while describing a pure devotee. It is a heavy responsibility on our part.

If one makes an argument that words have double meanings and some derogatory words may actually words of praise, then if that was the case I can use any kinds of words for the Lord and His pure devotees and get away with it. When the brahmana from Varanasi composed the verse apparently glorifying Lord Gauranga but which had bhakti-viruddha-siddhantas in the use if it's words, he was first heavily chastised by Shrila Svarupa Damodara Goswami for being offensive and then at the end he took the positive side of it too just to not humiliate the brahmana completely and give him a chance to engage in Gauranga-bhajana.

The word "rigid hagiography" is used sometimes. Hagiography means a worshipful or idealizing biography or narration. Everything about a pure devotee is always rigidly ideal so there is no other option but to be use rigid hagiography to describe him. It may appear to our material vision sometimes not ideal but that is our fallacy due to the imperfectness of our material vision and senses. Even a slight doubt that all of his activities and writings are not rigidly ideal is quite dangerous for everyone (writer, reader, listener etc) in my view point which is based on the scriptures.

That is why it is normally said that one should read and understand the Bhagavata and the books of the Acharyas under the guidance of an advanced living devotee follower of those teachings who has implicit faith in them and in all the previous acharyas. Then all our doubts are cleared.

Doubts raised for further knowledge are quite necessary. Doubts raised in a challenging manner are not recommended in the Bg. and are best handled one on one. This is true; at the same time, there is a proper way of expressing a doubt, and an improper way of expressing a doubt. And unless you ask questions or make points that could be construed as blasphemous, it is likely that you will not get a complete understanding of a subject matter infact you will bewilder others too. However, there is a proper way of expressing such doubts, even those that are blasphemous and that is privately or personally approaching an advanced devotee.

And if one is not fully convinced even after humble inquiry from a qualified devotee(s), it is better for our ownselves that we keep it to ourselves and think that it because of our own inperfectness and conditioned nature that we are not able to understand some of the writings and activities of the pure devotees and pray and beg to the Acharyas and Lords Nityananda-Gauranga to gradually give us the qualification that we can understand one day rather than making a big propoganda about it and trying spread one's own faulty and limited understanding to other devotees. There is a saying in English: "It takes one to know one." In such cases we should constantly remember the above verse from Shri Chaitanya-Charitamrita Cc. Madhya 23.39:

yanra citte krsna-prema karaye udaya
tanra vakya, kriya, mudra vijneha na bujhaya

"Even the most learned or advanced or elevated person may not be able to understand fully or even partially the transcendental words, activities, symptoms and characteristics of a great pure devotee acharya situated constantly in pure love for Lord Krishna and Lord Gauranga."

Thus my proposition is also that saintly persons should themselves be very very careful when they specially describe the characteristics of pure devotee Acharyas (nitya-siddhas or maha-bhagavatas) and not give a chance to people to misunderstand in any way whatsoever. If they can't do that due to a lack of implicit faith then they should desist from describing or talking about a pure devotee. That is what makes their own saintliness.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Damodara Svarupa Dasa says:

2008-06-12 12:15:51. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda, Gauranga, Hare Krishna.

Hagiographies come in two kinds: practical and critical. The former ones tend to stretch the truth and was used to instruct the 'common people'. It has a pejorative reference to the works of contemporary biographers and historians whom critics perceive to be uncritical and even "reverential" in their writing. A practical hagiography is by no means a biography. On the other hand, a critical hagiography, using a scientific approach, focuses on dry facts only. Though these dry facts always seem to be put aside as 'too mundane'... Yet these facts are a part of the truth as well. Why should this part of the truth than be considered as blasphemy? Or criticism? Or an insult? And why neglect these facts anyway? All this muddling doesn't do any good to the teaching/learning process itself.

In the Christian tradition, scientists are continuously searching for new evidence/proof of what is written in the Bible. The fact that they once and a while make very impressive discoveries, give us new insights (cf Qumran scrolls). At least they try to tell the “facts-as-they-are”. Combine this with what one knows about the Holy Bible and faith can become even more solid. Also look at the hagiography by Pope Gregorius on St Benedictus. At least that's a nice mixture of both a practical and critical hagiography and lots can be learned from it.

>>But what if it does not stick to the truth? <<
This seems to be the part where the shoe pinches. What do we accept as the truth and which part of the truth is not at all acceptable? This raises yet another question: which veil should be thrown over that part we don't like to hear? The answers are stereotypic. Either one is not pure enough to understand it, or if one is an erudite person, the typical answer is that even a most learned person cannot comprehend the actions of a pure devotee. That uneasy part of the truth can also be rejected as blasphemy, causing fall down, ... What a waste and what a pity!

>>A factual and highly respectful hagiographical biography of an Acharya will certainly tell us how a great soul become a saint for our inspiration.<<
You said it yourself: "tell us how a great soul become a saint". This person already is a great soul. It doesn't tell about their struggles and, more important, how they overcame these obstacles on their way to God. There's no teaching by example here and the disciple is left on his own again. He has yet again to find out for himself...

Therefore, the reactions I've read on this topic are very disappointing, indeed. I at least was hoping for a very open minded approach to the truth.

Damodara Svarupa dasa

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Swami says:

2008-06-12 14:20:01. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Dear Damodara Svarupa dasa, Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna! Pranaams. I apologize for your disappointment. In the pure branch of our Gaudiya Vaishnava philosophy, we do not read or allow and are not even remotely interested in critical hagiographies of pure devotees. We consider it an offense to have a critical mentality about the lives of pure devotees. Neither do we associate with people who write critical biographies of even non-perfected devotees, what to speak of the associates of the Lord...shrivanti gayanti grinanti sadhavah.

Whatever other traditions want, they may do, but we Gaudiyas have our own principles. Nowadays openess, universal acceptance, interfaith, critical views etc. have become the favorite path of many religious traditions but we have our own restrictions as given by Lord Gaura Himself which I have explained in the next paragraph. Therefore, a comparison of our philosophy with other philosophies may not be appropriate.

Our Vedic scriptures do not need any evidence/proof from modern day science to support the Vedic scriptural injunctions. Even if the modern science has apparently some mundane proof against a Vedic injunction, we will still accept the Vedic injunction. We place our full faith in the perfected souls who have composed the Vedic scriptures and not on the imperfect scientists who are hampered by the four imperfections of bodily identification. We absolutely do not need scientific proof or critical hagiographies to awaken our faith in the Acharyas and the Vedic scriptures. That necessary faith awakens in our soul simpy by chanting the Holy Names.

[quote]This seems to be the part where the shoe pinches. What do we accept as the truth and which part of the truth is not at all acceptable? This raises yet another question: which veil should be thrown over that part we don't like to hear?[/quote]
It is not above any shoe pinches at all. Swami BG Narasingha also does not accept all parts of the Sva Likhita Jivani as authentic because of some quite offensive statements (not merely dry statements as you say) against the Acharya and the lack of faith in the conception and character of the person who received this letter and kept it with him for a long time. Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada also had many fundamental philosophical differences from the person who received this letter.

The truth remains that some actual actions of the Acharyas simply cannot be understood by our defective mundane vision. However additionally there are some falsified mundane actions which are attributed to the Acharyas and sometimes to the Lord Himself, which simply cannot be the truth and which were never performed by the Lord or the Acharyas. So stating untruth as the untruth is actually for removing the veil over the untruth and not to hide or cover the truth. Obviously we will feel pain if some gross untruth is spread about our Acharya Shrila Sacchidananda Bhaktivinoda Thakura. Of course that pinches the sincere followers of Shrila Bhaktivinoda Thakura.

[quote]The answers are stereotypic.[/quote]
The answer is simple. Because the Sva Likhita Jivani was not officially authorized or published by Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada himself, we do not accept all parts of it as authentic. We accept the authorization of an Acharya to verify the authenticity of a book written by another Acharya. This may seem 'stereotype" but it is the safest path for our own spiritual lives and thus we accept this one.

[quote]You said it yourself: "tell us how a great soul become a saint". This person already is a great soul. It doesn't tell about their struggles and, more important, how they overcame these obstacles on their way to God. There's no teaching by example here and the disciple is left on his own again. He has yet again to find out for himself...[/quote]
A pure devotee even though perfect right from the beginning is subjected to many trials, tribulations and obstacles in his life directly by the Lord, in order to show us the ideal example of how to face these difficulties in our own lives. An ideal biography will certainly describe these difficulties which a pure devotee had to pass through but in a very respectful and absolutely non-critical manner. I have to confess that even "hagiography" is not fully correct word to express what I am stating. I will post an ideal biography of Shrila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Prabhupada written by Shrila Bhakti Pradipa Tirtha Maharaja as an example after some time.

[quote]I at least was hoping for a very open minded approach to the truth.[/quote]
Honestly, in the philosophy of Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, we have a limit to which we can be open-minded. The Lord severely chastised His intimate associate Shrila Mukunda for being very open-minded to various other philosophies not favorable to Bhakti. The sincere followers of Lord Gauraanga have to accept this "restriction" in our Gaudiya philosophy and remain within the constraints of open-mindedness which is allowed by the Lord Himself so that one does not step over the authority of the Lord Himself and does not displease Him. This may look like a "limitation" or "restriction" in our Gaudiya philosophy but it is ultimately for saving us from the grave dangers of a multitude of speculative philosophies which have become popular in Kali Yuga. A little restriction is most beneficial for our spiritual benefit.

I hope this helps somewhat to comfort your disappointment. This is a friendly discussion and is not a tense discussion meant to prove one over the other. I rather feel it has been an interesting discussion which have brought to light many finer points which would not have been discussed without your valuable contributions. I am sorry if you felt offended in any way but that was not my intention at all.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Damodara Svarupa Dasa says:

2008-06-12 17:08:21. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda, Gauranga, Hare Krishna.

>>This is a friendly discussion and is not a tense discussion meant to prove one over the other.<< Yes, that is what it is. This is a friendly, open yet honest discussion, not at all meant to offend or whatsoever. While looking through the glasses of my Christian background, I’m trying to understand what You’re saying and why You’re stating things. And these so-called differences (between our cultures) are not always easy to comprehend. Things get even more complicated since I’m not writing in my native language, but in English.

The way the Christian saints dealt with their ‘devils’ is an example for all of us. We can learn a lot from them if we can understand their situation to the fullest. There’s been a lot of writing on the live of St Benedictus. And he had lots of ‘devils’ to deal with. Thanks to the vivid hagiography by Pope Gregorius, we learn a lot on how St Benedictus overcame his ‘devils’, even his mundane ‘devils’. This teaching by example is what I’m looking for. It shows the process how a man gradually becomes a pure devotee and by the Grace of God becomes a saint.

I dare not compare myself with Shrila Mukunda, but yes, I use my Christian background to cultivate my bhakti. Essentially, Christianity is not that different from the teachings of Lord Gauranga. True, the outer form is different. E.g. Benedictine monks value silence a lot. But they pray practically the whole day, which makes them Laksheshvara as well...

Here’s a poem (in Latin) for You, Swamiji

Omnen horam occupabis
Hymnis, psalmis, et amabis
Tenere silentium.
Super hoc orationem
Diliges et lectionem,
Nutricem claustralium.

Chant every hour of the day
Your hymns, psalms en love
to keep the silence.
Above all, love to pray
And read spiritual works,
This is the necessary monastic food.

Damodara Svarupa dasa

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-12 19:30:44. Replies | Top | End | Reply

We may look at diamond from many different sides and according to our position we may see different colors. Similar, to know one requires one. That is why activities of pure devotees are mystery and we may not understand them completely.

If we are looking from mundane perspective we will be confused. Srilla Haridasa Thakur was born in Muslim family. Was he vegetarian in his childhood? Jagai and Madhai were committed to drinking and lusting but they were Jaya and Vijaya. Prahlada Maharaja was raised in demoniac environment and his teachers tried to learn him all kind of material "knowledge". When sage Narada wanted to learn about power of Lord's illusory energy, he took birth as "ordinary" human being, have wife and children etc. How we can understand this? Vrtasura was great devotee but still he was playing role of great „deamon“. Is this part of major, Lord’s plan?

Acharyas and great saints are teaching by example. To lead and instruct persons in this fallen age, Acharya will not come floating with shining aura around. No. To understand acharya or advanced devotee we need real sight. Just like our Srilla Prabhupada. We may learn a lot from his life.

Do great saints, gurus and acharyas have „human“ side of life, or only divine, 1008% absorb in pastimes of Radha-Krsna? Do such elevated souls also feel attractions and attachments for their parents, sons, friends or they are look at them equally as other souls? Are they feeling pain, sorrow, depression, diseases? May them also be subjective? Or not?

Open conversation and taboo-free attitude are needful for successful preaching in this times. This is simply nature of today’s world. Should spirituality be taboo-free? Is real spirituality dogma or not? Where is that tiny line between? That is question that puzzles many persons.

100 hundreds years ago humanity was completely different. If we need to bring knowledge in modern society we must accept what is their present stage and preach according to that. Srilla Prabhupada is great example. He changed so many things according to modern times. Many persons did not understand for example why he allowed womens to be part of ashrams or some other things, but he made necessary arrangements according to time, place and circumstances. Activities of such great souls are not easy to understand.

To understand hagiographies of pure devotees we also need to become pure devotee. Sometimes we may read or find many confusing points or "facts", but to understand them we need to be on right level of understanding.

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Your's Igor

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Swami says:

2008-06-13 01:07:30. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Dear Damodara Svarupa dasa, Nityananda! Gauranga! Hare Krishna! Jaya Shri Guru Parampara! Pranams!

[quote]Yes, that is what it is. This is a friendly, open yet honest discussion, not at all meant to offend or whatsoever.[/quote]

Thanks so much for your kind understanding and for the nice poem.

[quote]While looking through the glasses of my Christian background, I’m trying to understand what You’re saying and why You’re stating things. And these so-called differences (between our cultures) are not always easy to comprehend.[/quote]

I can fully understand. Differences in cultures and language do take a lot of effort on our part to reach to the truth. Christianity in it's original pure form is similar to the pure Vaishnava philosophy. Presently there are so many branches, different philosophies, paths etc. under the broad umbrella of Christianity which may be quite different to Christianity in it's original devotional form as taught by Jesus, which is what makes it more difficult. Especially if the impersonal or formless philosophy seeps in then it becomes quite different from the pure devotional path. I have not studied all the different paths or philosophies in Christianity to actually discuss them.

[quote]There’s been a lot of writing on the live of St Benedictus. And he had lots of ‘devils’ to deal with. Thanks to the vivid hagiography by Pope Gregorius, we learn a lot on how St Benedictus overcame his ‘devils’, even his mundane ‘devils’. This teaching by example is what I’m looking for. It shows the process how a man gradually becomes a pure devotee and by the Grace of God becomes a saint.[/quote]

There is a difference in the biographies of two different kinds of saints. There are nitya-baddha souls who slowly elevate themselves to an advanced position. They have to struggle and attain success. They are quite glorious because they accomplish an almost impossible task of overcoming Maya by the mercy of the Lord. There are nitya-siddhas who directly descend from the spiritual world (associates of the Lord). In their case, there may or may not be struggles in their lives. And if there are struggles they are different than in the first case. They are deliberately orchestrated in their lives by the Lord Himself to glorify them further in this world. The nitya-siddhas never have to struggle actually because Maya cannot even come close to them as they are already perfected souls. Their lives may look like a struggle but it is not. They never come under illusion or Maya's influence nor do they have to internally struggle with any 'devils'. Thus, their biographies have to be written in an even more careful and very very respectful manner so as not to spread wrong information about them or make them look like nitya-baddhas. Thanks again. I am thankful you are kindly trying so sincerely to understand this discussion inspite of the cultural and language differences.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Swami says:

2008-06-13 06:06:20. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna! Thank you Igor for your nice post about the mystery of the lives of the pure devotees.

[quote]When sage Narada wanted to learn about power of Lord's illusory energy, he took birth as "ordinary" human being, have wife and children etc.[/quote]
Just a small note. Shrila Narada Muni did advent as the exceptional householder and leader of all Vaishnavas, Shrila Shrivasa Thakura, in Kali Yuga. The other story floating around about Shrila Narada coming as a another ordinary householder and becoming illusioned by Maya is not quite supported by our Acharyas and Vedic scriptures.

Daaso'smi, Swami Gaurangapada.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-06-16 10:27:17. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Just a note : I felt wery blisfully day after Bhima-Nirjala Ekadashi. Power of full fasting on Ekadashi is amasing! By fasting on Ekadashi mind is becoming calm and steady and simply by observing ekadashi-vrata person is gaining so much on bhakti-account. This year I had that realisation, that Bhima-Nirjala Ekadasi is so special day and source of our devotional strenght for whole year. I felt so blisfull that I am presently thinking to observe every ekadashi only taking water. Also if person observe ekadasi fully, he or she will get determination. I am typing this short note during busy office day... Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna And, yes...we are waiting for Bh. Matus realisation in his daily writings. Nitaaai Gaaura premanande!

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-07-03 07:01:35. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
Another short note (I am very "busy" in recent period).
While fasting fully for Bhima Nirjala ekadashi I had realization how is fast (or taking light food) directly connected with our body, mind, attitude etc. Therefore I became inspired to naturally reduce my meals and now I am feeling better then ever. So much energy, mind is steady and undisturbed. I am avoiding grains and taking one meal in afternoon and feeling energized like never before. Also I have desire to fully fast or only drink water on every ekadshi, not only on Bhima Nirjala Ekadashi. Body and mind thus becoming healed and full of energy. There are many, many relevant informations about this on web, about benefits of fasting on both bodily and spiritual level.
Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
Igor

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2008-12-31 23:50:20. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada!
All glories to Nitaai Naam! All glories to Gaura Naam! All glories to Hari Naam!

Today while I was chanting Nitaai Naam on my japa Lord gave me small drop of His causeless mercy to understand just a little how great His mercy is. I understand that when devotee is put in hard situation it is Lord's mercy because Lord want pure devotion and surrender from devotee. It is His mercy.

I was so happy and grateful that I heard and be able to chant Nitaai Naam. How great is His Mercy! Lord Nityananda is only hope for this age and His name is only remedy. Everything within this material world, body, karma, our present situation, everything is temporary, but our devotional attempts, our connection with Naam is eternal.

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

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Jai Nityananda Gauranga says:

2009-01-01 12:33:46. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Dear Bhakta Igor,

Nityananda ! Gauranga ! Hare Krishna !

Since I have read a lot of your realizations I very well know that you are very very advanced compared to me. However I would like to share something that I have heard.

Bhakta Igor wrote : I understand that when devotee is put in hard situation it is Lord's mercy because Lord want pure devotion and surrender from devotee. It is His mercy.

I heard that there are two Tattvas. Nitaai Tattva and Krishna Tattva. Devotees who only chant the Hare Krishna Mahamantra are under Krishna Tattva. In Krishna Tattva the Lord sometimes gives distress to His devotee so that the devotee can come much closer to Him and thus recieve love of God. However devotees who chant Nityaananda Gauraanga Naam along with the Hare Krishna Mahamantra are under Nitaai Tattva. In Nitaai Tattva Lord Nitaai directly and immediately gives love of God in exchange of just a little faith. He never tests His devotee nor does He ever give distress to His devotees.

However Lord Nitaai is an independent God so He can follow the standards of Krishna Tattva anytime according to His desire. Keeping this in mind His devotees should be ready for any tests.

I request you to throw more light on this as I am always thirsty for knowledge about Lord Nitaai's mercy.

ys,
Mihir.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2009-01-02 03:53:13. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Dear Mihir,
I am not advanced, I am real fool. That is true. Only because I have small faith in Swami Gaurangapada and because he still is so merciful toward me I am still trying to become devotee.

I do not know answer to your question. I may try to answer according to what I had read from Gurudevas writings and according to books of previous acharyas.

There are three kind of perfect, most highest jivas - first, devotees who are engaged in krsna lila - with their spiritual body eternaly engaged in vrindavana rasa in spiritual world. Such perfection is result of pure chanting of Krsna Naam, Hari Naam. In this age of Kali, it is almost imposable for us to attain that stage of pure chanting if we chant solely Krsna Naam because we are making aparadhas.

Also there are gaura lila nitya siddhas and also gaura lila sadhana siddhas - with their spiritual body eternaly in Gaura lila. This perfection is attainable by chanting Gaura and Nitaai Naam. There is no doubt about that.

But, there is also third kind of most perfect souls - with two spiritual bodies both in krsna and gaura lila. Such perfection is attainable by chanting both nitaai and gaura naam and hari naam.

Love in separation is more intense then in union. Whole Gaura lila is example of this. Sometimes, in order to intensify devotees desire to attain Him, and also to teach non devotees, Lord may put His devotee in hard position. Actually that is Lord's mercy because then devotee is completely and fully surrender to Him. We also may see that there are many examples of separation also in Gaura lila. When Nityananda Prabhu left Ekachakra, His parents were in agony. Lord Gauracandra took sanyasa and His wife left in separation from Him constantly chanting His Name. Lord Gauranga Himself manifested ultimate separation feelings in Puri, feeling separated from His Lord Krsna. So both, union and separation in spiritual realm are two sides of same coin - pure love and have nothing with material distress.

Also when devotee is on very beginning stages of devotion like myself, Lord may help him by taking comfort, material possessions etc. and show real face of this material world to devotee so that all daubhts or seeds for material enjoyment are becoming destroyed in core of hearth. If you are fortunate, Lord will take away everything material, but He will give pure devotion. That is His Name - Hari - He who takes away. And Lord Chaitanya is Gaurahari.

We also must understand that Lord Gauranga gave us highest philosophy - acintya bheda abheda tattva. He is Krsna but He is in role of devotee. Nitaai and Gaura Naam are at the same moment identical with Krsna Naam, but also different from Krsna Naam, because Mantrarajas do not accept our ofencess.

We also may see that our great acharyas gave us example of this. Srilla Narotama das Thakura is crying

ha ha prabhu nityananda premananda sukhi
krpabolokana koro ami boro dukhi

"My dear Lord Nityananda, You are always joyful in spiritual bliss. Since You always appear very happy, I have come to You because I am most unhappy. If You kindly put Your glance over me, I may also become happy."

Also our great Acharya Srilla Bhaktivinoda Thakur is explaining mercy of Nitaai

kobe nityananda, more kori' doya,
charaibe mora visayera maya
diya more nija-caranera chaya,
namera hatete dibe adhikar
kabe ha'be bolo se-dina amar

When will Nityananda Prabhu be merciful to me and deliver me from the enchantment [maya] of the sense objects? When will he give me the shade of his lotus feet and the right to enter the market place [hama-hatta] of the Holy Name? When, O when, will that day be mine?

I am hoping that I gave you some hints. Dear Gurudeva, please correct if I gave wrong explanations.

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

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Venkat says:

2009-01-02 13:46:15. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda Gauraanga Hare Krishna!

Dear Igor prabhu,

What a wonderful explanantion! This is so nice. Thank you so much! :-) Thank you Mihir for raising this topic.

Always eager to have your association,

A great sinner,

Dasadaaso'smi,

Venkat

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Jai Nityananda Gauranga says:

2009-01-02 14:01:48. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Dear Bhakta Igor,

Nityaananda ! Gauraanga ! Hare Krishna !

I will always respect you as an advanced devotee because your realizations and all your God brothers' realizations are the real source of my enthusiasm without which I would have certainly fallen down.

Bhakta Igor wrote : Also when devotee is on very beginning stages of devotion like myself, Lord may help him by taking comfort, material possessions etc. and show real face of this material world to devotee so that all daubhts or seeds for material enjoyment are becoming destroyed in core of hearth. If you are fortunate, Lord will take away everything material, but He will give pure devotion.

I read this in the Krishna book. However I heard that only devotees under Krishna Tattva face this situation as they find it difficult to surrender due to offenses. For devotees under Nitaai Tattva, Lord Nitaai does not take away their possessions nor does He give them any distress rather He directly gives them love of God thus they automatically surrender to Lord Gaurahari and their Lordships Shri Shri Radha Krishna.

I hope you will throw more light on this also.

ys,
Mihir.

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Jai Nityananda Gauranga says:

2009-01-02 17:26:17. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Dear Bhakta Igor,

Nityananda ! Gauranga ! Hare Krishna !

I would like to share a chat I had with Swami Gaurangapada in which the same topic is being discussed. The reason I am keen to share this is because I want the whole world to realize the mercy they will recieve by chanting Nityananda, Gauranga and the Hare Krishna mahamantra together. Please note I have deleted some parts in between to maintain my privacy.

NGN= Nityaananda Gauraanga Naam
HKMM= Hare Krishna Mahamantra

me: Gurudev, I just saw your video how to deal with distress, in that you said that the Lord gives distress so that we can come closer to Him, but in our chat last time you said that this is only in Krishna tattva whereas in Nitaai Tattva there is no distress
8:14 PM swami@nitaai.com: In the material world, one cannot escape from distress fully
dukhalayam
8:15 PM me: yes, but in Krishna book it is said that if a person if very dear to Him then He puts Him in distress and takes away everything from Him and seperates him from his family
you mean even Lord Nitaai work likes this ?
swami@nitaai.com: No
I mean no one can escape old age, disease and death
8:16 PM so some distress will come
me: yes, but in your video you said that to test the person the Lord will put him in distress so that his real test begins
8:17 PM I mean how does Lord Nitaai test a person ?
swami@nitaai.com: Lord NItaai does not
He needs only faith
He gives love
He does not test
me: ohh, so in your video you were talking about Krishna tattva ?
swami@nitaai.com: yes Mihir
swami@nitaai.com: Nitaai normally does not test, but He is the independent Lord, He can also test
me: but Gurudev, your followers are in Nitaai tatva then why did you preach about Krishna tattva ?
all your followers chant NGN
8:27 PM If we chant NGN and HKMM still we fall under Nitaai Tattva then why did you preach about Krishna tattva (devotees who chant only HKMM )
swami@nitaai.com: Because They are inseparable
me:I mean we chant NGN and HKMM together still we fall under Nitaai Tattva then why did you preach about Krishna tattva devotees who chant only HKMM
swami@nitaai.com: One cannot preach only parts of our philosophy
One has to preach about all the Tattva
me: if I chant 16 of HKMM and take initiation then will I fall under Krishna Tattva ?
8:29 PM swami@nitaai.com: Besides Nitaai can follow the standards of Krishna Tatva anytime He wants so NGN devotees should be ready for it
me: yes, I can follow any tests except this same test in the future
follow = face
8:30 PM swami@nitaai.com: Thank you Mihir
I have to go now.
swami@nitaai.com: Since you are chanting NGN you will always be under Nitaai Tattva
even when you chant 16 rounds of HKMM

Nityaananda! Gauraanga! Hare Krishna!

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2009-01-02 18:12:26. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada!

Thank you dear Mihir and Venkat Prabhu das on your kind words. I am praying to someday have your association in Dham, where we may chant together and serve Gurudeva in his mission.That is perfection of life. Please pray for me so that I may have enough strength to realize that in this life time. Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Dear Mihir, could you please quote source of this statement about Krsna and Nitaai tattva? I personally did not heard about such statement, so please could you give us exact source so we may discuss further acroding to guru sadhu and sastras.

What is sure is that if jiva become blessed Lord will arrange different situations so that jiva may develop pure devotion. Sometimes such arrangements may look like distress but they are blessings. Let me give example. Nityananda Prabhu is ocean of mercy. But He is in the same time independent. He become angry and throw rice on Sri Advaita Prabhu, He kicked Srilla Sivananda Sena with His lotus feet. Who can understand Lord Nityananda? Only His devotes, by His mercy may understand such pastimes, for others such transcendental activities are great mystery. Srilla Haridasa Thakura had to suffer whipping in 22 market places but he continued to chant the Holy Name of the Lord without interruption! Such are pastimes of Lord and His associates, very mysterious. Only devotees, via Lords mercy may unlock mysteries of such pastimes.

Srilla Sivananda Sena is praying -
CC Antya 12.27: "Today You have accepted me as Your servant and have properly punished me for my offense."
CC Antya 12.28: "My dear Lord, Your chastising me is Your causeless mercy. Who within the three worlds can understand Your real character?
CC Antya 12.33: One of Sri Nityananda Prabhu's characteristics is His contradictory nature. When He becomes angry and kicks someone, it is actually for his benefit. "

There are also examples of Chota Haridasa who took sanyasa from Lord Caitanya Himself.Chota Haridasa looked with lust at a woman. He was at once rejected from the society of Lord Caitanya's personal associates. Previously Lord Balarama killed Romaharshana Suta with blade of grass and many persons were puzzled why He did it? That is independent nature of Lord, including Nitaai tatva as well.

From other side, those who take shelter of the lotus feet of Lord Nityananda are always rescued from all sorts of distress. Nitaai pada kamala koti candra susitala. How to understand such so called opposite statements? Only via bhakti, devotion. That is acintya-bheda-abheda philosophy of Lord Gauranga Mahaprabhu.

My humble opinion is that Lord Nitaai is extremely merciful and He knows what is best for particular devotee. He is within our hearth and know our most hidden problems. He may purify us on whatever way he wants, that is His sweet will. If he wants to give us lotus, we will accept it, if he want to club us, we will accept it, just like Srilla Sivananda Sena did.

aslisya va pada-ratam pinastu mam
adarsanan marma-hatam karotu va
yatha tatha va vidadhatu lampato
mat-prana-nathas tu sa eva naparah

"Let Krishna tightly embrace this servant, who has fallen at His
lotus feet. Let Him trample Me or break My heart by notbeing visible
to Me. He is a debauchee, after all, and can dowhatever He likes, but
He is still no more other than the worshipable Lord of My heart."

Srilla Prabhupada is telling us about this (Back to Godhead Magazine Octobar 1944)

"Devotee is always fearless because he knows well that nothing can happen without the sanction of Godhead directly or indirectly and as such everything that comes from Him is considered by the devotee as His grace. Even in the most reverse position he (the devotee) stands without any fear and accepts all odds as His blessings in different forms."

Also, Gurudeva recorded wonderful video "How to respond to distress". In this video you may find reason why are we sometimes in stressfully situation. It is mercy of Lord because then we may with whole hearth call out Nityananda, Gauranga, please accept me! This world is empty without You! Please be merciful toward me.

So please, could you give us exact source of statement about Krsna- tattva and Nitaai - Gaura tattva devotees so that we may discuss further. Srnvatam sva katham krsnam.

All glories to Swami Gaurangapada,
Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2009-01-02 18:17:30. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
This is perfect explanation. Thank you so much. All glories to Swami Gaurangapada
Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2009-01-02 18:23:50. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
Here is wonderful verse about this topic

nityananda-prabhura saba caritra — 'viparita'
kruddha hana lathi mari' kare tara hita
CC Antya 12.33:

"One of Sri Nityananda Prabhu's characteristics is His contradictory nature. When He becomes angry and kicks someone, it is actually for his benefit."

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Jai Nityananda Gauranga says:

2009-01-03 05:33:29. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda ! Gauraanga ! Hare Krishna !

Thank you for such aa inpriring quote Bhakta Igor.

I would like to share another inspiring quote by Shrila Prabhupada

Two Lords, Nityananda Prabhu and Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, They have appeared just to reclaim the fallen souls of this age. They are more kind than Krishna. Krishna, He is also very kind. He comes to deliver. But Krishna demands that first of all surrender. Chaitanya Mahaprabhu even does not demand surrender. He is so kind. (voice choking) So take shelter of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and be happy. Thank you very much.

ys,
Mihir.

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Venkat says:

2009-01-04 11:47:22. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityaananda Gauraanga Hare Krishna!!

Thank you Igor prabhu, for that excellent explanation! All glories to Swami Gaurangapada! All glories to the Vaishnavas!

Dasadaaso'smi,

Venkat

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bhaktatommy says:

2009-01-08 04:09:58. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda! Gauranga! Hare Krsna!

Please accept my humble obeisances,
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada,

With material eyes we may see distress and difficulties.
By Nityanandas mercy we come to see that actually all is serving us like a specially soft bed prepared special for each of us.

Your servant,
bhaktatommy

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2009-06-26 15:23:51. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada!
All glories to Srilla Prabhupada!
All glories to Nitaai and Gaura Naam!

Initiation is beginning of real life. It came upon me as ultimate guru-krpa or mercy of Gurudeva. There is no question of any qualification. It is mercy of guru. I would like to write down in this diary some off my insignificant realisations, just in order to glorify my eternal spiritual master and this sublime process of chanting Nityananda Gauranga and Hare Krsna maha mantra and to encourage anyone who may reading this just to have faith in spiritual master. We may lose all hope in ourselves, but Gurudeva have faith in us, and therefore we are still here, by his mercy.

Last week my brother and his wife told me that they will received initiation into chanting Nityananda Gauranga and Hare Krsna from Gurudeva via internet conference! What blessings! Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna! I was very happy to hear this and my brother asked me to came if I found some time. At that time I felt great inspiration within to bring Deities of Nityananda and Gauranga to their home. My brother is very attached to Lord Jagganatha and he have Jagganatha, Baladeva and Subhadra Deities, but I felt very inspired to bring Nityananda and Gauranga Deities. He agreed.

Night before initiation I had dream of Gurudeva. He was waking me up and telling me something about initiation. When I wake up I thought this is all my speculation, so soon I try to forget this and continue with ordinary daily activities.

Usually I am 1000% busy with ordinary jobs activities,and taking care of my little 2 year old son, but by Lord's arrangement just few days ago my wife Marija and my son went to some relatives to town Ruma, so I was free to attend their initiation. Now i can see that this was perfect arrangement of Lord, because otherwise I would probably stay at home. Also, that day I worked second shift on radio from 13PM so I was free all morning. All this may look like coincidences but I can understand that Guru and Krsna mercifully helped me to accept spiritual life more seriously.

I wented to house of my brother and his wife around 6 AM. They were already dressed in vaisnava clothes, ready for initiation. they arranged beautiful altar and were waiting for Gurudeva to made call. I did not want to make any disturbance and wanted to stay behind silently chanting.

Soon after that Gurudeva contacted them and said that he will begin in about 15 minutes. I just shortly typed on chat that I just want to thank him for bestowing his mercy upon my brother and his wife. "Who is this" he replied. " Davor's brother, Igor" I answered.

Then Gurudeva mercifully corrected me by writing that my brother and his wife are more advanced then me and that I need to try to make further advancement. I replied shortly yes, and then Gurudeva wanted to see
me via camera.

I bowed down before him, feeling like complete idiot and fool. What a rascal I am. Evidence that Lord Gauranga and Nityananda are giving mercy to most fallen. I give up all hope in me. But Gurudeva did not. He say to me "we must hope against hope." That is only hope for us, mercy of guru.

I felt at that moment that I want to die, to vanish anywhere. Fool I am, otherwise I will accept this process seriously and fully embrace Gurudeva's mercy and orders.

Then Gurudeva told that all free of us may be initiated and asked me to think about that. What? I thought. It struck me like thunderbolt? What is this now? I started to pray to Lord Nitayananda within my hearth. Why are you doing this to me? You brought me here and now you are trying to embrace me here. I was dressed in jeans without tilaka, without anything.
Why are you playing on such way Nitaai? - I thought. I tried to escape and to live ordinary life. My plan was to live so-called ordinary life and then in old age go to Ekachakra-Dham and die. But now you brought me here before your pure devotee.

After several minutes Gurudeva came back on-line again and asked us are we ready. He asked me if I thought about that and I just reply - guru-krpa. That is my real position, nothing more then guru-krpa, mercy of guru. What is my qualification. There are no qualifications. Our only qualification is fortune to bow down before spiritual master.

He asked us to do acamana and we do it. I thought, Oh I am not dressed properly, impure within and without, so I chanted Nityaanda and Gauranga Mantrarajas while taking water from acamana pot. By chanting Mantrarajas, I thhought everything is becoming pure.

After that Gurudeva asked us to chant Mangalacarana mantras for invoke all auspiciousness. We chanted,, repeating after him and after that he asked who will receive initiation first. I embraced my brother and said his name, and he agreed.

I felt great joy by witnessed this special occasion. That meant me a lot, to see my brother initiated into chanting Nityananda and Gauranga Naam and Hari Naam. What else I may desire? If I do not succeed in attaining pure love for Lord Gaura-Krsna, if I become swallowed by Maya, he may succeed and help me. Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

Dayala-Nitai! Such wonderful name. We embraced each other. Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna

After that his wife, Djurdjica was about to become initiated. She repeated Nityananda Gauranga and Hare Krsna Maha Mantra three times after Gurudeva. It is very hard to properly pronaunce her name for
non-slavic lenguage speakers so Gurudeva asked aboutproper pronancuniation. He said that now she will have name that everyone knows and it will be easy to remember - Jaganattha devi dasi! Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna!!!!! Haribol! Such wonderfull name.

Then Gurudeva asked me to repeat after him. My hearth start to cry and tears started to flow down. I feltlike fool before Gurudeva, and my voice choked while I was trying to repead Holy Names after him. I cried like little baby, unable to move. His voice vibrated and I just listened to this sound knowing that this is most blessed moment in my life. He then gave me my new life and new name Ishana Thakura das.

Gurudeva spoke several instrunctions, but I was so shocked that I just stay like stone. One of his words came deep into my hearth, and from that moment I am thinking constantly about that. He said to me - "Dive deep into Naam". That is my goal, that is what I must to do, to dive deep into Naam.

I am writing this from my subjective perspective. Initiation is begining into chanting. Gurudeva said on initiation that disciple is receiving seed of devotion and that job of disciple is to water that seed by
regular chanting.

I am still completly shoched upon mercy that Gurudeva gave to me. I am not feeling that I deserved to be part of his transcedental family, but he is so mercifull. Now I must gave something to him. What I can do. " Dive deep into naam" he said to me. That I may try, to make my sadhana strong and unshapable by his mercy. To completly accept vaisnava behavior and tradition. To eat only prasadam. To pray to Lord Nitaai to help my Gurudeva in his mission of spreading Holy Names.

Guru-krpa is everything. this is not movement of qualifications, This is mercy movement. Thank you Gurudeva for have hope in me, evan when I lose all hope. I have feeling that I am now learning to pronaunce and chant again. It seems something different.

I just wanted to share my personal point of view to this most blessed moment in my life. Mercy of Guru is everything in our life. Now I am chanting Nityananda Gauranga and Hare Krsna with goal to satisfy my Gurudeva. He told me to dive deep into Naam. I have no qualification, but his strong desire brought me here and gave me new life, new name, new
future. By his desire all is becoming possiable in our life.

jogyato vichare kichu nahi pai
tomara karuna sara
karuna na hoile kandiya kandiya
prana na rakhibo ara

If you examine me, you will find no qualities. Your mercy is all that I am made of. If you are not merciful unto me, I can only weep, and I will not be able to maintain my life.

I am writing this into diary so that I may be able to remember this thoughts. If anyone is reading this please, listen to my words - mercy of spiritual master is all what we should pray for! If we may always remain under protection of his teachings, by chanting Holy Names, serving vaishnavas, and helping him somehow in this divine mission, we will attain all hapiness.

Dive deep into Naam. Dive deep into Naam.
So I am going to chant my rounds with desire to someday fullfill desire of my Gurudeva.

Nityananda ! Gauranga ! Hare Krsna!
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada!

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Swami says:

2009-06-27 11:42:21. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda!! Gauranga!! Hare Krishna!! Jaya Shri Guru Parampara!! Thank you so much Ishana Thakura dasa for your most inspiring message. Shrila Ishana Thakura, the great Associate of Lord Advaita Acharya is Shri Mauna Manjari is the pastimes of Shri Shri Radha Krishna.

Daaso'smi, BR Sadhu Swami Gaurangapada.

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Ishana Thakura dasa says:

2009-11-27 21:17:28. Replies | Top | End | Reply

Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
All glories to Swami Gaurangapada!
All glories to Nitaai and Gaura Naam!

Today while chanting most sublime Nityananda Naam i had several insignificant realisations that I want to share with other devotees.

While chanting Nityananda, Nityananda suddenly it became clear that acctually everything is manifestation of Lord Balarama - Nityananda, that He manifests in order to serve Lord Gauranga Krsna on various ways. Lord Balarama, Maha Sankarsana, ananta, spiritual parafernalia...unlimited forms and manifestations. He is also ultimate guide and saviour before us in form of spiritual master. He expands and serve Gauranga-Krsna on so many wonderfull ways and chanting of His Name is highest peak of His Own Service, because simply by chanting Nitaai Naam all spiritual perfection is easily attainable. He personaly appeared in form of His Own Name - Nityananda to save us, to give us love for God. How glorious is our Lord Nityananda!